Posted by 2k9 T-Conn #4 on January 27, 2011 at 11:54pm
It seems to me from my point of view and generation that, hazing is what made bands great. it instilled that killer mentality. Was it really hazing that instilled this, or was it the people from that era; so how do you get more devotion to the band.
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Hazing has nothing to do with it. That is nothing more than some kind of slave mentality that suggests that people can't doing anything (right) unless they are threatened, beaten, or assaulted in some shape, form, or manner.
Truth of the matter is, even though hazing existed back in the day (and was worse than anything MOST OF US have gone through), folks back then were simply mored dedicated and devoted to the craft. They followed directions better, they knew how to lead by example, and they were willing to put their individual egos to the side and focus on getting the job done. Not to mention, they tolerated less BS, compared to today.
How to get more devotion to the band? Well, I guess the best solution to that question is to get more devoted people in the band. If they aren't devoted, then they shouldn't be there in the first place. Hard work, time, effort, and sacrifice (not hazing) will weed out those undevoted people.
Teaching is what gives you convidence. If you are prepared you will be better. More proficiency on the instrument. Creates better music and shows.Hazing does'nt teach siht.but Bafoonistry.
Hazing just gets you sued, in jail, on tv and put in a negative light. Who wants that kind of attention? Only a fool.
Texas Brass Leader said:
Teaching is what gives you convidence. If you are prepared you will be better. More proficiency on the instrument. Creates better music and shows.Hazing does'nt teach siht.but Bafoonistry.
What's your view, an how can we build back up our Bands
It seems to me from my point of view and generation that, hazing is what made bands great. it instilled that killer mentality. Was it really hazing t…
it starts with that very 1st day of band camp! once you instill in folks your level of standards and keep raising them people will rise to the challenge... hazing never makes you play better..yes it does keep you a little bit more focused and is a hell of a scare tactic but thinkn back to when i marched.. getting hazed never made me play better it just made me mad as HELL and just gave me that look of death on my face when i marched in the stadium.. it starts with leadership on down... you have to let ppl know you mean business and be consistent!
AMEN. Set the standards, keep them and never bend them.
Bandman said:
it starts with that very 1st day of band camp! once you instill in folks your level of standards and keep raising them people will rise to the challenge... hazing never makes you play better..yes it does keep you a little bit more focused and is a hell of a scare tactic but thinkn back to when i marched.. getting hazed never made me play better it just made me mad as HELL and just gave me that look of death on my face when i marched in the stadium.. it starts with leadership on down... you have to let ppl know you mean business and be consistent!
What's your view, an how can we build back up our Bands
It seems to me from my point of view and generation that, hazing is what made bands great. it instilled that killer mentality. Was it really hazing t…
Actually, I think that devotion is something that has to be practiced from childhood and applied in everyday life. I honestly don't expect a kid who has never shown any devotion to anything, while growing up, to join a band in college and suddenly let devotion filter into his brain like osmosis or something. These days, with all the stuff that's going on, along with all the crap they are exposed to (compared to the "old school" kids), it's hard for these kids to really show much devotion to anything...ESPECIALLY if it looks like it's gonna be productive and beneficial to them.
So...with that said, my suggestion would be to start at early childhood. Teach and mold those that are interested in music into being dedicated musicians. As they get older and begin to mature, introduced them to the craft, and expose them to it first hand. Allow them to appreciate it. By the time they are ready to go to high school and college, there may be a generation of devoted and dedicated kids, whom we MIGHT feel comfortable with in preserving the craft in a devoted and dedicated way.
"Teach a child the way he should go, so when he is old, he will not depart from it."
Hazing never solves any problem it creates them. From my pov its starts with the childs upbringing you have to instill discipline, character and self pride in child when they are young. My mom always told me whatever you do make sure you be the best and do your best in that. Not all the time I was the best but I put my best in it, and today thats still my motto. Kids today don't have the drive to be good all the care about is what can I get out of the situation instead of being a contributor. In my eyes not only band programs , but no program that requires any type of discipline of sorts will ever be the same.
I always see why people confuse hazing with being better because a while back when you were hazed, you were taught at the same time, not just hazed cause its what happened to those before you. All we have to do to get back our bands back to the way they used to be, is to teach the correct methods and stop looking for shortcuts.
That's what people aren't getting. The bands back in the day had more TEACHING going on, from the directors to the leadership, to the upperclassmen. Sometimes it came in the same package as hazing, so people confused the two.
Some people are getting their rocks off by going in on crabs, but can't march, play a B-flat scale, or choke some cymbals without dropping time. If that's who's in front of the section or band, what do you expect to happen after a year or two (or ten, for some bands)?
Bands have to be more selective about the character of people they let in. And once they're in, there has to be more effort made to educate them on their band operates, and how to pass it on the right way. If they don't want to get with it, cut/zip their @$$. No hazing needed for that. Also, people have to dare to be small for a year or two and clean house so that the future can be better. A few bands did this this year, and you could tell the improvement.
JT_pno2uapb said:
I always see why people confuse hazing with being better because a while back when you were hazed, you were taught at the same time, not just hazed cause its what happened to those before you. All we have to do to get back our bands back to the way they used to be, is to teach the correct methods and stop looking for shortcuts.
What's your view, an how can we build back up our Bands
It seems to me from my point of view and generation that, hazing is what made bands great. it instilled that killer mentality. Was it really hazing t…
Replies
Hazing has nothing to do with it. That is nothing more than some kind of slave mentality that suggests that people can't doing anything (right) unless they are threatened, beaten, or assaulted in some shape, form, or manner.
Truth of the matter is, even though hazing existed back in the day (and was worse than anything MOST OF US have gone through), folks back then were simply mored dedicated and devoted to the craft. They followed directions better, they knew how to lead by example, and they were willing to put their individual egos to the side and focus on getting the job done. Not to mention, they tolerated less BS, compared to today.
How to get more devotion to the band? Well, I guess the best solution to that question is to get more devoted people in the band. If they aren't devoted, then they shouldn't be there in the first place. Hard work, time, effort, and sacrifice (not hazing) will weed out those undevoted people.
Texas Brass Leader said:
Bandman said:
Actually, I think that devotion is something that has to be practiced from childhood and applied in everyday life. I honestly don't expect a kid who has never shown any devotion to anything, while growing up, to join a band in college and suddenly let devotion filter into his brain like osmosis or something. These days, with all the stuff that's going on, along with all the crap they are exposed to (compared to the "old school" kids), it's hard for these kids to really show much devotion to anything...ESPECIALLY if it looks like it's gonna be productive and beneficial to them.
So...with that said, my suggestion would be to start at early childhood. Teach and mold those that are interested in music into being dedicated musicians. As they get older and begin to mature, introduced them to the craft, and expose them to it first hand. Allow them to appreciate it. By the time they are ready to go to high school and college, there may be a generation of devoted and dedicated kids, whom we MIGHT feel comfortable with in preserving the craft in a devoted and dedicated way.
"Teach a child the way he should go, so when he is old, he will not depart from it."
That's what people aren't getting. The bands back in the day had more TEACHING going on, from the directors to the leadership, to the upperclassmen. Sometimes it came in the same package as hazing, so people confused the two.
Some people are getting their rocks off by going in on crabs, but can't march, play a B-flat scale, or choke some cymbals without dropping time. If that's who's in front of the section or band, what do you expect to happen after a year or two (or ten, for some bands)?
Bands have to be more selective about the character of people they let in. And once they're in, there has to be more effort made to educate them on their band operates, and how to pass it on the right way. If they don't want to get with it, cut/zip their @$$. No hazing needed for that. Also, people have to dare to be small for a year or two and clean house so that the future can be better. A few bands did this this year, and you could tell the improvement.
JT_pno2uapb said:
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